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What Would Stoics Do

Seneca · c. 4 BCE – 65 CE

On Benefits 5.19 ¶5 — Seneca

Translation by Aubrey Stewart (1887)

Seneca, On Benefits 5.19 ¶5

Note: An objection Seneca puts in an imagined opponent’s mouth (“The Adversary”) — not Seneca’s own view.

The Adversary: Because, if my son were to contract a loan, I should pay his creditor, yet I should not, therefore, be indebted to him; or if my son were taken in adultery, I should blush, yet I should not, therefore, be an adulterer. I say that I am under an obligation to you for saving my son, not because I really am, but because I am willing to constitute myself your debtor of my own free will. On the other hand I have derived from his safety the greatest possible pleasure and advantage, and I have escaped that most dreadful blow, the loss of my child. True, but we are not now discussing whether you have done me any good or not, but whether you have bestowed a benefit upon me; for animals, stones, and herbs can do one good, but do not bestow benefits, which can only be given by one who wishes well to the receiver. Now you do not wish well to the father, but only to the son; and sometimes you do not even know the father. So when you have said, “Have I not bestowed a benefit upon the father by saving the son?” you ought to meet this with, “Have I, then, bestowed a benefit upon a father whom I do not know, whom I never thought of?” And what will you say when, as is sometimes the case, you hate the father, and yet save his son? Can you be thought to have bestowed a benefit upon one whom you hated most bitterly while you were bestowing it?
— Seneca, On Benefits 5.19 ¶5 · tr. Aubrey Stewart (1887)Read in context →

Cite this passage

Seneca, On Benefits 5.19 ¶5, tr. Aubrey Stewart (1887)

https://whatwouldstoicsdo.com/passage/on-benefits/5.19.5

Seneca, Dialogues, tr. Aubrey Stewart (1887–1889). Text: Standard Ebooks (CC0). Sources and licences

Read Book V in context →

In plain English

AI-written notes

Doing someone good is not the same as giving them a favour: animals, stones and herbs can help us, but only someone who wishes us well can bestow a favour. So saving a son does not necessarily put his father in your debt if you never thought of the father, or even hated him.

Older wording

“creditor”
— someone who is owed a debt

Themes and situations

  • Kindness and forgiveness
  • Gratitude
  • Judgements and impressions
  • Family and love

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